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You are in "Collective Intelligence:1" ( http://WikiWorld.com Our Collective Intelligence manifest? )<br />
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surkumdev1 joined the room<br />
surkumdev1: hey<br />
jimscarver: hi<br />
jimscarver: so your single slit model worked nicely?<br />
surkumdev1: no<br />
surkumdev1: not really<br />
jimscarver: shucks.<br />
surkumdev1: the double slit has issues<br />
surkumdev1: the double slit behaves like particle interaction<br />
jimscarver: im not suprised...<br />
surkumdev1: actually purely many particle interaction<br />
surkumdev1: the wave nature is not found there<br />
surkumdev1: however, making a few changes does do the trick<br />
surkumdev1: i am working on it now<br />
jimscarver: don't think about waves<br />
jimscarver: think about multiple communication channels<br />
jimscarver: possible<br />
surkumdev1: mutiple communication channel?<br />
jimscarver: do the prism experiment first, split the light 50% left and right, join them so they have out of phase path and an in phase path to show how they only take paths that do not cancel.<br />
jimscarver: start basic....<br />
surkumdev1: yes, i am introducing phase into the stuf<br />
jimscarver: think of it as a chain of virtual electron and positrons, each having one two dimensions, manifesting a 3 dimentional position only when they encounter a like particle of opposite spin. no waves are involved.<br />
jimscarver: have you studied semiconductor physics at all?<br />
surkumdev1: yes, i know a little bit of it<br />
surkumdev1: i did VLSI stuff<br />
jimscarver: when i realized that an electron hole and a positron were identical mathimatically, i got it.<br />
surkumdev1: yes<br />
surkumdev1: what did u get?<br />
jimscarver: an elecron changing state leaves a hole that is a virtual positron which in turn leaves a hole that is a virtual electron, .... propogating at the speed of light.<br />
surkumdev1: huh?<br />
jimscarver: +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<br />
jimscarver: the overall operation is an elecron in the sorce, excluding an electron in the target, manifesting space between them, without taking any particular path in 3d space as they are only 2 dimentional.<br />
surkumdev1: jim, turn it into code<br />
surkumdev1: that i can understand<br />
jimscarver: the receiver in the target must see a minus if it is plus, or a plus if it is minus.<br />
jimscarver: the magnitude of the state change must fit in the receiver and be in the direction is "wants" to go.<br />
jimscarver: http://InformationPhysics.com/QET2.htm<br />
surkumdev1: ok<br />
surkumdev1: looking at it<br />
seth''the''homie joined the room<br />
jimscarver: hi<br />
seth''the''homie: yo hi<br />
jimscarver: what are you into?<br />
seth''the''homie: i dont know, just the room's name has attracted my attention<br />
jimscarver: so far, physics and God are the topics<br />
jimscarver: today<br />
seth''the''homie: alright, any highlights?<br />
seth''the''homie: i mean the startpoints<br />
jimscarver: we are objectively trying to facilitate a collective intelligence but are often drawn to the spiritual, or extant collective intelligence, the cosmic conciousness and such.<br />
jimscarver: lots choose a topic, or look at www.WikiWorld.com<br />
jimscarver: quations? ideas? dreams? desires?<br />
jimscarver: my nature is to be an information physicist<br />
seth''the''homie: i'm checking out the site, ideas? well not now, dream and desire was the only, ideal being, i mean i'm in search of anythin that ideal and or infinite<br />
jimscarver: hum, you may have been born in the wrong world<br />
seth''the''homie: yes, i gave myself the same answer recently, actually it has hurted me alot<br />
jimscarver: there is the lamb... http://www.wikiworld.com/wiki/index.php/SevenLamb<br />
jimscarver: is that the sort of thing you mean?<br />
jimscarver: or check out http://www.wikiworld.com/wiki/index.php/WhoIsGod<br />
jimscarver: i believe reality is finite and discrete. such is all the evidence.<br />
jimscarver: http://www.wikiworld.com/wiki/index.php/InformationPhysics<br />
seth''the''homie: wat is reality?<br />
seth''the''homie: i mean wat sense you put in that word?<br />
jimscarver: i got something ideal and infinite random numbers!<br />
jimscarver: random<br />
jimscarver: reality includes the objective physical universe as well as subjective being.<br />
jimscarver: wikiworld is a good place for your quest. please join us====<br />
seth''the''homie: okay, how do you thin, can be human feelings classified onto positive ones and negative ones? + and -<br />
jimscarver: something as they can be put in words on this page they can and are put in chemical-eletrical codes.<br />
jimscarver: it is patterns on all frequencies, the music of life...<br />
seth''the''homie: i understand. but those codes, can we say there are just 2?<br />
jimscarver: all deserve to fullfull thier dreams in so far as it does not infringe on the rights of others, oh well, undeserved left already....<br />
jimscarver: no, there are gazillians of codes<br />
seth''the''homie: just 2 kinds, + and -, positive or negative, we feel joy or sorrow, happyness or sadness (i'm sorry for my language)<br />
jimscarver: change, however, is ultimately binary, change or no change, some integer number of times.<br />
seth''the''homie: you mean it is joy * 5 ?<br />
jimscarver: there can be any finite number of degrees of happiness. pardon my spelling<br />
seth''the''homie: and also any finite number of degrees of sadness, but there is no other special feeling ?<br />
ksenokrates joined the room<br />
jimscarver: so many levels is seems continuous as does the physical world.<br />
seth''the''homie: scare is just on of the strongest feelings but it is negative<br />
jimscarver: every feeling is like a separate song.<br />
darkclou joined the room<br />
seth''the''homie: that's wat i'm talking bout, i belive they are not, there is only 2 kinds + and - why do we give them different names?<br />
ksenokrates: what is intelligencew here?<br />
jimscarver: brb<br />
seth''the''homie: k<br />
ksenokrates: what are you scared of?<br />
darkclou left the room<br />
ksenokrates left the room<br />
[[NotaParticularlyGoodNickname]] (notaparticularlygoodnickname) joined the room<br />
jimscarver: hang on... brb<br />
notaparticularlygoodnickname left the room<br />
seth''the''homie: i'm hangin<br />
jimscarver: you believe there are just 2 kinds?<br />
seth''the''homie: yes<br />
seth''the''homie: can you prove otherwise?<br />
jimscarver: i think so.<br />
seth''the''homie: my beliefs are based on logical chains<br />
seth''the''homie: i call it cold mind<br />
seth''the''homie: and i also believe that the minds is inbetween of feelings between + and - it's 0<br />
seth''the''homie: *mind<br />
seth''the''homie: it is always remain, feelings are vain they discrement from + and increment from - until 0<br />
jimscarver: one sec... on phone, getting off..<br />
seth''the''homie: ok<br />
jman8564 joined the room<br />
jman8564: hello seemingly empty room<br />
seth''the''homie: but not that obviously, hello<br />
jimscarver: sorryt about that, friend called...<br />
seth''the''homie: dont worry<br />
seth''the''homie: it's okay<br />
jman8564: so, what's new with you people<br />
seth''the''homie: i'm patient<br />
jimscarver: seth says there is only 2 emotions, right seth?<br />
seth''the''homie: yep, i think the word feelings is better, more precise<br />
jimscarver: or 2 levels for each emotion.<br />
seth''the''homie: no just to kind of feelings : positive or negative<br />
jimscarver: so happy and sad have no degrees? but what if I am very happy? isn't that a degree of happiness?<br />
seth''the''homie: yes but it is still positive, it is positive * x but not the new feeling<br />
jimscarver: but anger is certtainly different than fear, both are negative.<br />
seth''the''homie: isnt anger is just another fear?<br />
jimscarver: envy and hatered are different<br />
seth''the''homie: but they are just negative it is -<br />
jimscarver: no, fear may turn into anger or hopelessness<br />
jimscarver: or determination<br />
jimscarver: some feeling are not positive or negative necessarily.<br />
seth''the''homie: i'm thinkin<br />
jman8564 left the room<br />
jimscarver: lust. whimsy.<br />
seth''the''homie: it is conditioned by language.. wen you feel something dont try to find it's name.. just.. if you would like to feel it one more time or not?<br />
jimscarver: every song has a different feeling to it,<br />
jimscarver: out behaviour is conditioned by positive and negative only uptimately, but the war in ourselves as to whether it is positive or negative is the uniqueness of the feeling.<br />
seth''the''homie: if you dont know the language how will you explain to somebody that it is envy or fear or "determination?" emotions? but ones uderstand is it positive or negative<br />
seth''the''homie: okay, love? friendship? are they feelings?<br />
jimscarver: they are different, fear is adreanalin rush.<br />
jimscarver: they are actions, but also feelings i expect.<br />
seth''the''homie: so friendship and love is a duty<br />
jimscarver: contentment is caused by seritonan levels, is that what you mean? it is different than fear caused by adrenelin.<br />
jimscarver: not a duty, a way of acting, putting another before self in thought and action.<br />
seth''the''homie: but isnt it a duty? isnt it ideal if you never fail to put another before self? overwhelming own desires and feelings?<br />
jimscarver: sadness is not at all like fear or envy or anger except in that they are negative.<br />
jimscarver: but it is my duty to fight is i get drafted, though I am a pacifist.<br />
seth''the''homie: can you rephrase that please?<br />
jimscarver: if i get called to fight in war that is my duty.<br />
seth''the''homie: love to homeland?<br />
jimscarver: duty implies what you are supposed to do, or feel you must do, not just that you do it because you want to as in friendship and love.<br />
seth''the''homie: exactly, so wat is the basis of love and friendship?<br />
jimscarver: realizing that what is important is greater than self.<br />
seth''the''homie: dont you realize that the safety of your homeland is more important than your own? that's why you pick a gun and go to war<br />
surkumdev1: hi<br />
seth''the''homie: hi<br />
surkumdev1: what up seth<br />
surkumdev1: is seth a russian name?<br />
seth''the''homie: i'm having a dialogue wit mr. Jim<br />
jimscarver: my honey says i got to get off the computer now. quicik physics question kum? final question seth? kum can see our transcrpt and pick up where i left off<br />
seth''the''homie: no seth is american i guess, my real name is nikita, it is greek name, but i live in ukraine and my native language is russian, i dont know why you ask but i think it would be more honest<br />
seth''the''homie: when the friendship starts?<br />
surkumdev1: you want to know when friendship starts? may be, when there is enough trust and admiration for each other individual<br />
seth''the''homie: so wat is the value of friendship that based on admiration and trust?<br />
jimscarver: the whole is greater than the sum of the parts.<br />
surkumdev1: well, it depends on how each individual assigns it<br />
surkumdev1: there are different kind of friends<br />
seth''the''homie: how it can be different kinds covered by one word?<br />
seth''the''homie: friend is just friend<br />
surkumdev1: there are friends for conviences<br />
surkumdev1: there are true friends<br />
surkumdev1: and they are lovers<br />
surkumdev1: there is also bother hood<br />
puppyonmyfeet joined the room<br />
puppyonmyfeet: good evening jim<br />
jimscarver: -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------<br />
seth''the''homie: okay, thank you, it's just really hard to understand the meaning of the words that are not experienced on my own, unlike fear or joy<br />
surkumdev1: oh<br />
surkumdev1: hey puppy<br />
surkumdev1: well, seth, it depends.<br />
surkumdev1: so, what is your real question?<br />
puppyonmyfeet: hi surk how about inserting the word giggle in every sentence<br />
seth''the''homie: wat is friendship and wat is love, are they different and are they feelings?<br />
jimscarver: she is asking how sadness and fear are different.<br />
surkumdev1: well, friendship also has a component of intimacy to it<br />
puppyonmyfeet: well one is real the other is experienced<br />
surkumdev1: take women, for example, they do these seperating all the tine<br />
surkumdev1: most women think that their children are the smartest in the world<br />
surkumdev1: and their husbands are the best<br />
surkumdev1: and better than anyone<br />
jimscarver: seth thinks there are only two feelings, good and bad.<br />
puppyonmyfeet: they just see them that way the best mothers anyway<br />
surkumdev1: women usually show more perference for their own family<br />
seth''the''homie: no just hold up? if i ask you wat the joy is? wat is your answer?<br />
jimscarver: passion is neither good or bad necessarily<br />
puppyonmyfeet: of course it about survival and seth is right there is only good and bad<br />
surkumdev1: so, loving someone would equal to having no rational opnions of the other person?<br />
jimscarver: friendhip plus passion is the feeling love?<br />
surkumdev1: what is joy? joy is a profound feeling of happiness<br />
surkumdev1: i think the word joy has become a clique and has lost meaning<br />
puppyonmyfeet: exactlly love is an insanity that prevents rational thought as it should be<br />
surkumdev1: i agree on puppy there<br />
jimscarver: thats lust, no?<br />
puppyonmyfeet: no lust is just feeling<br />
surkumdev1: well, lust is something you do with a prostitute<br />
seth''the''homie: you see it is simple to answer wat the joy is, cuz you are fast to remeber the last time you was happy, but wen i ask wat the love is you have no actual answer, cuz you cant remember exact moment<br />
surkumdev1: or cheap slut<br />
surkumdev1: well, me feeling joy?<br />
surkumdev1: that happened like years ago<br />
puppyonmyfeet: it takes a male to make a slut<br />
seth''the''homie: but you still remember<br />
surkumdev1: too<br />
surkumdev1: well, i agree that males do that<br />
jimscarver: a male slut<br />
puppyonmyfeet: sure<br />
surkumdev1: but slut is someone who would like you to pimp their mind<br />
seth''the''homie: i'm just tryin to say that love and friendship are not feelings.. cuz feelings are cheaper than mind<br />
surkumdev1: you have to play mind games to get a slut<br />
surkumdev1: well, i disagree<br />
puppyonmyfeet: all married people do that it is just ok then<br />
surkumdev1: feelings are extremely powerful things<br />
surkumdev1: well, i dunno puppy. I am not married<br />
surkumdev1: and really, i dunno want to be married to a woman who wants to play mind games<br />
surkumdev1: some women who like are extreme opposites of them<br />
surkumdev1: but they are rare to find<br />
surkumdev1: and most of them are taken<br />
puppyonmyfeet: that is a given but remember we are all animals and the reason for everything is survival whether it be of your intellect or lust<br />
jimscarver: i don't like the word slut at all as it is almost always used unfairly<br />
puppyonmyfeet: it is just a word<br />
surkumdev1: seth, feelings are powerful things<br />
surkumdev1: they are far superior than the mind<br />
seth''the''homie: but not stronger than mind<br />
jimscarver: a deragatory degrating word<br />
seth''the''homie: no<br />
puppyonmyfeet: i do not agree<br />
surkumdev1: well, they are<br />
surkumdev1: u need to let them take control of you<br />
puppyonmyfeet: feelings or words?<br />
surkumdev1: a computer that try to beat kasprov tries billions or trillions of moves in parallel<br />
seth''the''homie: have you ever jumped wit parachute?<br />
surkumdev1: kasprov uses his feelings to think quickly<br />
surkumdev1: he doesnt go a move by move<br />
surkumdev1: well, i havent jumped out of a parachut<br />
seth''the''homie: just answer that question please, have you jumped from the plain?<br />
surkumdev1: i said no,<br />
surkumdev1: i havent jumped out of plane<br />
puppyonmyfeet: ah the computer analogy does not work<br />
surkumdev1: well, what is your point?<br />
surkumdev1: i want to.<br />
surkumdev1: but someday, i will.<br />
jimscarver: you are wrong kun, they are human beings who are just a bit more friendly then is good for them. they are human beings with complex needs and desires you are in no position to judge.<br />
seth''the''homie: watever you feel fear, joy, anything else, the strongest will be thinking at this moment<br />
puppyonmyfeet: why would anyone jump out of a plane?<br />
russohio joined the room<br />
surkumdev1: jim, what r u saying?<br />
surkumdev1: i am wrong on what?<br />
jimscarver: only he who is without sin can judge<br />
surkumdev1: well, jim who am i judging?<br />
puppyonmyfeet: what is sin?<br />
russohio left the room<br />
jimscarver: slutting<br />
surkumdev1: no, i wasnt talki about that that<br />
puppyonmyfeet: what is slutting<br />
seth''the''homie: ok thank you all for your time.<br />
seth''the''homie: ail be goin<br />
surkumdev1: i was sayin that feeling are supiorer than the mind<br />
jimscarver: bye, may your passions be varied<br />
surkumdev1: well, puppy<br />
surkumdev1: as i said, a slut is someone who you need to control in order to get a response<br />
puppyonmyfeet: well i see that you think acting on your feelings eliminates thinking<br />
surkumdev1: if you leave them to judge, they will just let someone control them<br />
seth''the''homie: and i'm sayin that the mind is supiore than the feelings ye passions are gud, especially wen you can control them<br />
jimscarver: oh<br />
surkumdev1: i use them when i program<br />
surkumdev1: well, feelings are powerful things<br />
surkumdev1: when i do physics<br />
surkumdev1: even profs do that<br />
surkumdev1: go to a really talented physics prof<br />
puppyonmyfeet: ah there is another way to come at this problem<br />
surkumdev1: and you will realize that he uses the world 'intitutive' a lot<br />
surkumdev1: and they will tell you to learn to feel problems<br />
jimscarver: never heard the word used that way.....<br />
surkumdev1: well, i know extremely talented profs who use the word<br />
surkumdev1: for example, Vishwani Agarwal, IEEE fellow did that<br />
puppyonmyfeet: if you look at it as human varible<br />
surkumdev1: and one of the talented and highly respected math prof at Rutgers, told me that too<br />
jimscarver: slut i mean, sorry, yes intuitive results are felt.<br />
surkumdev1: and Dr Steve Ferry, who ranked 13th on the putnam exam said the same thing. And told me that is how he actually got that rank<br />
jimscarver: what?<br />
surkumdev1: what do u mean by 'what'?<br />
surkumdev1: putnam is this really really hard math exam where more than 80 percent of people who take it get 0s.<br />
jimscarver: problems are felt i presume<br />
surkumdev1: yes<br />
surkumdev1: you feel problems by working out examples<br />
puppyonmyfeet left the room<br />
seth''the''homie: but they are solved after the mind's actions<br />
surkumdev1: no, well the mind is the last one to make a judgement<br />
surkumdev1: the mind tells how to direct one's subconsious processes<br />
surkumdev1: for example, suppose, you get stuck on a problem, you move on<br />
surkumdev1: something the mind tells you<br />
seth''the''homie: alright give the answer by using your power feelings , 2 + 2 = ?<br />
surkumdev1: but usally feelings always guide to a solution<br />
surkumdev1: inventions do not come from logical thought processes<br />
surkumdev1: if they do, they are just developments<br />
surkumdev1: i know people who can<br />
surkumdev1: i know people who can do 3193921392193x371731239018381028302 by feeling the answer<br />
jimscarver: it is like when you close your eyes feel something with your fingers, it has texture resiliency, coolness, pattern. Many different things have a different feel. problems and circumstances have different feelings in our mind.<br />
surkumdev1: for example, a famous example is Ramanuijan<br />
surkumdev1: most of them time he was never able to prove his formulas<br />
surkumdev1: but he used his feelings to get them<br />
surkumdev1: and they were right<br />
surkumdev1: some people have this 'number sense'<br />
surkumdev1: it's rare<br />
jimscarver: 1187280356447216376631262774846286<br />
surkumdev1: and mostly people are taught not to listen to their feelings<br />
surkumdev1: and that they are illogical<br />
jimscarver: i cheated.....<br />
surkumdev1: ha<br />
surkumdev1: however, the best people in the world do otherwise<br />
surkumdev1: my brother is considered to be a best chess player in his school<br />
surkumdev1: and he was ranked like top 100 in star craft<br />
surkumdev1: considering that a million people play this game<br />
seth''the''homie: so can we make a conclusion that the mind is not that neccessary part of human? and how come it have developed to it's current state?<br />
surkumdev1: well, feelings/intuition has been with us for a billion years<br />
jimscarver: got to run<br />
surkumdev1: the mind and reason are relativitly new<br />
puppyonmyfeet joined the room<br />
surkumdev1: ok, jim<br />
seth''the''homie: yes it explains<br />
seth''the''homie: bye jim<br />
surkumdev1: the mind may be a way to delegate feelings<br />
surkumdev1: for example, think about it as manager<br />
jimscarver: leter all, sorry leave, hope you all come back<br />
</pre><br />
<br />
{<br />
� Here is a model of the toy animals and people use to 'feel' impossible answers. Though we have little experience of this yet, 5 people who 'link their toy' in this domain, can literally solve any possible problem, almost instantly.<br />
<br />
A graphic representation which I should animate, but need an animator for:<br />
http://www.organelle.org/ddd.html<br />
<br />
Please, don't wait. Rebuild the ring. Remember our 'cognitive tail'. Learn, and link them, now, for mutual uplift and biospheric rescue...please<br />
<br />
Discussion of this toy is primarily in the upper portion of this page, though I have other essays on it. For the moment I refer to it as an internally transtemporal connectivity window. Some would call it an angel. It's also an angle...it's a sentient connectivity device which is an emergent property of cellular symbiosis, and 'physics', though the latter is largely falsely founded.<br />
<br />
http://www.organelle.org/sadasah.html<br />
}<br />
[[Category:DearDiary]]</div>imported>Import