Where is AnewGo? If it has no territory except online, then how can its laws take precedence over those ones defended by those burly fellows in blue suits?

Where is it? Well, that is a better question to ask AnewGo, or look at www.anewgo.tk, but do not worry about "burly fellow in blue suits". AnewGo 'WILL NOT' take over other lands, and they 'WILL NOT' invade other countries.

See War

I suggest if we wish to define land holdings of AnewGo we keep a AnewGoLandResigter of land that is owned by AnewGo citizens and Legal Entities. The issue of invasion becomes irrelevant. See AnewGoMap

No it isn't. You can be invaded if you own land. Others might take it from you. Governments can seize it by right of their own sovereignarity and immenent domain. Think about it.

AnewGo is only immune from physical worries such as having to defend its land so long as it stays non-physical. Otherwise, you are going to need someone to protect your physical holdings from invasion, seizure, vandalism, theft. If you depend on nations to do that, then those nations will feel that they own/have soveriegnity over those physical locations.

Think it through. ---StarPilot

How would that work, Invading yourself? The point of the first statement you were responding to was that AnewGo has no people on the side, no bordering countries.

The biggest problem comes when you try to define AnewGo, is it Physical based for some parts, Online Based for others......

Well first off, you aren't invading yourself, are you? Whenever there is an invasion, there is an UsAndThem happening. Otherwise, it isn't an invasion.

Second, if you have land that belongs to AnewGo, held or volunteered by AnewGoCitizens, then there is always the possibility of invasion. Look at Waco, Texas and that little cult house going up in flames. That was property that the cult decided belonged to them, not the government. Notice that the government got ticked off about that, and decided to make excuses to rectify that situation.

If I buy land out near where I live, hear at the Rocket City, and declare it's part of AnewGo, the United States Government is going to tell me tough luck. And that will work all the way down to the local level. All those organizations will still expect taxes on it, they will still expect I have to maintain it according to laws for land here, and they will take it from me anytime they want, because they are the Sovereign, and I am not. (They the Might, I the Weak.)

Yes that is true. I think geographical nations need not worry. AnewGo does not extinguish US sovereignty over that land due to the concept of ExtraLaw. I think the occurances of Land siezed must be fairly small, since most citizens seem to be fairly happy with their present ownership of Land do they not?

Think it through. Land is where you buy it. It doesn't move. The reality of what's around it doesn't change. Therefore, it has all the same problems as before. Nothing has changed in that regard. ---StarPilot

If you take an Icon and drag it to the opposite side of your computers Desktop, is it still the same Icon? WikiWorld is online, but exists simultaneously at different places (wikiworld.com, informationphysics.com, Whitescarver.com....etc). Can't AnewGo move? It's Virtual==== Online! --KenSchry

==

Same Icon, different location. But we aren't talking icons. We are talking physicality. You know, servers. Land. Meeting Places. Churches. Bank Vaults. Records stored offline.

WikiWorld is a location. Wherever its server is, that's it location. That's the juridiction that determines what is legal and illegal at WikiWorld. WikiWorld violates that (like, say, hosting an Al-Qada How To Kill The President Task Project), and you can bet WikiWorld will get invaded. By a PoliceForce. And shut down. Move it? Nope, sorry, it is shut down.

Now, Jim and the gang could try to set up another WikiWorld, after the Secret Service bust the server, the operator, the owner, and oh, Jim and his gang. But they won't be getting their WikiWorld back.

People confuse virtual world as not being any world. That isn't true. We just have the power, via this medium, to (practically) instantly communicate anywhere in the world. Well, anywhere someone can get a connection to the internet.

Under the law, there is nothing 'virtual'. And that's the way governments will keep it, to maintain their power/status quo. That is why there is that 'country' (SeaLand) that is sited on an 'abandoned' oil well in the North Sea. So that the servers there are under that 'country's jurisdiction, and therefore people can do things that it sees as legal (which is a lot more permissive then most countries). But that doesn't stop you or me from still being under the nations sovereignity that we are physically located in, while making use of SeaLand. It is still illegal for me to register (place) a bet with a casino at SeaLand, because I'm still in my country, under its laws.

Right now, people get away with so much, because it is difficult for any government to sift through all the data-streams and find people doing things they don't like. But they are getting better and better at it. That I know first hand. Soon enough, they will be able to monitor all citizen usage of the Internet. There where will you be? No nation will recognize you are AnewGoCitizen as a nationality. Just a cult or a game. Fun fun... ---StarPilot

This is interesting. The example of SeaLand is regressive, it is purely another european tiny principality only recognised by Germany really and by default Britain. But it is there. Yes there will be strong resistance to accepting the reality of AnewGo.

Now we've gotten to the heart of AnewGo. It's a game, a vision of a new society.

See AnewGoGame

And Jim can't be busted. I don't know if he could handle it. :-) ---

The first test for AnewGo will be TheAnewGoDelagation if this is sucessfull the domain of www.anewgo.gov.go will exist.

The next test will be once the population reaches 1000 AnewGo will request recognition from countries of similar populations.

What is the obession with invasion? Do you not have any confidence in the legal structure of the geographical state in which you are currently residing? using the concept of ExtraLaw.

AnewGoMap will resemble a mass of dots scattered over the globe.

How can you invade that?

Easily. Piece by piece==== Just like how they raid the illegal drug distribution network, or cult houses, or the intellectual piracy rings, or the pedaphile rings, or the sex slavery rings, ad naseum.

==

Isn't 'ng' the domain of New Guini? Well nigeria actually [1] Good. i didn't like that one anyway. it will need to be changed to .go which is much better.

Which piece would you choose to invade first, and why?

-- I wouldn't invade any, as I am actually a very peaceful fellow. However, if you are planning on a bit of length for AnewGo with some property, then it would not be unusual for some of it to be invaded. The invasion may be temporary (such as a DEC facility being invaded by SWAT and Secret Service a while back), or of a more lengthy invasion, or a permanent take over of the land/facilities in question. Given enough time, with property, it will all happen.

Your mind doesn't seem to be particluarly peaceful, since you believe this will happen. For this end AnewGoInvasionSimulation.

Just because you plan what you will do if someone doesn't stop at the stop sign on a side street to what you are travelling, does not make you a MadMax. It makes me someone prepared to handle that possibility. You do not believe in discussing something, because it might give it power? You let your fears determine your behavior?

Thought is the basis of action. Warlike thoughts lead to warlike action. You seem to spend a lot of time describing warlike actions. If you cannot accept the strong contention that the internet itself is based on, that a distributed system is the best defense against attack. Then we have opposed view points.

--Again, if you don't plan for something, you cannot mitigate its effects when it happens. Just because I take note of the fire exits when I go somewhere, doesn't mean I am an arsonist.

As far as the Internet goes. Two words: Slammer Worm. Within 10 minutes, it had shut down entire parts of the internet. Particularly well noted in the media: South Korea. Not a city in it, but almost the entire nation's networks. Slammer could have been a lot worse, and its descendants most likely will be.

So, are you proposing we build some form of AnewGoInternet, in which it is an all private network that only runs on the AnewGoCitizenry machines?

The Internet has clearly survived these pointless and childish attacks. People very clearly will repair it.

And AnewGo could digitally vanish today and the citizens will just rebuild it tomorrow. It is an idea foremost and an attitude, just like the feeling anyone has for their nation.

'Of course I would advocate sensible procedures such as backups. How is that going?'

 I haven't worried about backing up my stuff here. You should email Jim about how he backs up WikiWorld and AnewGoWiki if you are that curious.
 'Weekly tape backups cost $100 to restore.  We all should make occational backups at PhpWikiAdministration.  I just saved zip files on my pc at home.  The backup can be loaded into PhpWiki or TikiWiki.' -JimScarver

SP: The trick to the Internet is to remember it is currently a collaborative effort. People will stop spending their money to share their resources with the world, freely, at some point. This is a given. The only question is when this will occur. Just being persnickity at the moment...

 'But they can earn AnewGo cpu and storage credits (chits)'

And land seizures are not something that is broadcast about, far and wild. It always makes land holders uneasy.

'I declare my back yard to be AnewGo green acres. sieze it, I dare ya :)'

) LOL. there is a humourous quality to this, but you get the general idea. Slowly AnewGo will grow. Even if finds many obstacles to establishing itself among the community of nations, it will always represent the will of organised people.

See AnewGoDelagation